tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post116269225985455765..comments2023-11-05T12:39:29.721+00:00Comments on De Viris Pulchris et Aliis...: Polish government continues to spew homo-hateRIChttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162906101571843422006-11-07T13:28:00.000+00:002006-11-07T13:28:00.000+00:00Hello Gray! I'll be thrilled to read that post of ...Hello Gray! I'll be thrilled to read that post of yours really soon! That is an excellent idea indeed, which is all the more welcome as changes in American dominant powers are anxiously awaited.<BR/>As to homophobia, I believe you meant the Polish government, not the Portuguese! The general mentality around here may still be homophobic, I know it is, but no government of ours - especially not nowadays! - would dare say what the Polish did. In spite of everything (this country is traditionally catholic as well), I believe they'd be jobless the very next day...<BR/>As to the positive role the USA has been playing worldwide since WW1, I couldn't agree more. One has to know History in order to understand the present. Otherwise it would be just an exchange of opinions and points of view, many of them clichés as well.<BR/>Thank you so very much for your contributions! :-)RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162904992501626272006-11-07T13:09:00.000+00:002006-11-07T13:09:00.000+00:00Hello Joel! As far as we around here are concerned...Hello Joel! As far as we around here are concerned, we have already had our Saddam, almost 50 years long, with a more civilized, European face. But we've had him. And then nobody was willing to help us get rid of him... So is History: a shameless display of hypocrisies...<BR/>Wish you a fine day! :-)RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162896030679926282006-11-07T10:40:00.000+00:002006-11-07T10:40:00.000+00:00Well written, Mariano. You bring a lot of good con...Well written, Mariano. You bring a lot of good conversational points to the table. I thank you for that.<BR/><BR/>Ric, thank you for the email. I will do what you suggested.<BR/><BR/>Also, I read what your comment: "I suppose you'll agree with me when we,non Americans, say America (meaning the USA) doesn't give a damn for the rest of the world." I do understand how many governments and many people in the world can think that. But only *if* they are referring to the American government! I know for a fact that, according to the United Nations, America's citizens give almost 2 1/2 times more to international causes then does the American government.<BR/><BR/>Are all Portuguese homophobic because of the Portuguese government's harsh statements about homosexuality? Of course not! It would be wrong to damn the Portuguese because of the actions of their government unless the actions were absolutely horrendous and the people remained silent about them.<BR/><BR/>More on this will be coming up in a post on my blog as soon as I scrape together (in a condensed and coherent form) pertinent data.<BR/><BR/>Believe me, my dear friend, I detest some of the things that my government has done, internationally. But, when one looks at the bad he must also look at the good and then, placing them on the scales of justice, form an enlightened opinion.<BR/><BR/>Perhaps Joel is correct. Maybe every country *does* have its own Saddam! I'm just praying that none of us ever see another Adolph!<BR/><BR/>Enjoy the week!Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08428046291631841793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162883282333251152006-11-07T07:08:00.000+00:002006-11-07T07:08:00.000+00:00I guess every country has a Saddam!?I guess every country has a Saddam!?Jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11849862214265777969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162867745297679402006-11-07T02:49:00.000+00:002006-11-07T02:49:00.000+00:00Olá André, boa noite! De todos os adjectivos que u...Olá André, boa noite! De todos os adjectivos que utilizaste o que me parece que não devemos perder nunca de vista é: perigoso.<BR/>E o problema é que a sede de poder engasga qualquer um que hoje se diz moderado... Amanhã acorda fanático se preciso for, para saciar a abjecta sede.<BR/>É bem mais do que uma vergonha. É um funesto perigo!<BR/>Um abraço, meu caro!RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162864352632600162006-11-07T01:52:00.000+00:002006-11-07T01:52:00.000+00:00É realmente triste que a extrema direita esteja a ...É realmente triste que a extrema direita esteja a ganhar tanta relevância em tantos países da UE. Os extremos são sítios muito perigosos, é preciso ter muito cuidado. Acho que nenhum partido moderado, digno de tal designação, deveria aceitar fazer uma coligação governativa com um partido dessa índole. É uma vergonha.Andréhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04290920679123821356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162816140560127092006-11-06T12:29:00.000+00:002006-11-06T12:29:00.000+00:00Hello Joel! I do understand your reaction! At firs...Hello Joel! I do understand your reaction! At first one really doesn't know what to think or what to say... How is it possible in the beginning of the 21.st century?!<BR/>Hugs, dear friend!RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162812396942328182006-11-06T11:26:00.000+00:002006-11-06T11:26:00.000+00:00It's the third time I read this in two days. I jus...It's the third time I read this in two days. I just don't know what to say.<BR/><BR/>I can't believe in our day and age...<BR/><BR/>I'll have to come back.Jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11849862214265777969noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162807867080734862006-11-06T10:11:00.000+00:002006-11-06T10:11:00.000+00:00I do agree with you, Minge. It isn't! But do we ha...I do agree with you, Minge. It isn't! But do we have a better model? Mrs. Thatcher's era, perhaps?...<BR/>If we don't want democracy to turn into a worse joke than it is already, we citizens must be aware and ready to act!<BR/>Thank you, Minge!RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162806711961868122006-11-06T09:51:00.001+00:002006-11-06T09:51:00.001+00:00The EU is a model of liberalism and enlightenment....The EU is a model of liberalism and enlightenment. I hope it's only a matter of time. I hope.Mingehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16690119444596624935noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162752645295086532006-11-05T18:50:00.000+00:002006-11-05T18:50:00.000+00:00Hello Mariano! Good arguments well argued, in my o...Hello Mariano! Good arguments well argued, in my opinion. It's never easy to go beyond what is typical this or typical that, because some times generalization and prejudice eventually coincide...<BR/>Thank you so very much for your contribution!RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162741786281085242006-11-05T15:49:00.000+00:002006-11-05T15:49:00.000+00:00Excellent article, Ric. The european council HAS t...Excellent article, Ric. The european council HAS to make it clear to the polish government that this kind of behavior is not acceptable. I do believe this will happen, but it has to be soon. Sad to say, there are many other groups in many other of our member countries that would do the same if they could. Some of them are quite strong, too.<BR/><BR/>As for the point you raise, gray, i think you're absolutely right in saying we should all be careful to distinguish at least between administrarions and people, not only when we talk about the US, but of all countries. Given the way in which most of so-called democracies work today, one can't even blame the inhabitants of a country for the rulers they have "chosen". I certainly don't like it when people judge me by looking at the catastrophic history of Argentina (yet it continues to happen to me, all the time!). <BR/><BR/>I think that for things to really change in a worldwide scale progressive thinkers from all over the world must be able to work together, and the slip of tongue you point out does signal a kind of generalization that gets in the way.<BR/><BR/>As a latin american and a citizen of a country that experienced both european colonialism and american imperialism (and there's those adjectives again!) i can tell you that there's a lot misguided generalizations. People refer to the "US" and "Spain" sometimes with hatred, as if they were one body and one mind. Still, it's difficult to blame them for the generalization, in the same way it's difficult to blame the American people for being stuck with their present government (even if the majority that had elected had been clear). People are manipulated, and unless you engage them in conversation and argue all this stuff out with them, change does not happen.<BR/><BR/>So, thanks for the chance.MARIANOhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13039017410465853243noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162731508290398912006-11-05T12:58:00.000+00:002006-11-05T12:58:00.000+00:00Well, Gray, I can understand your outburst, to sta...Well, Gray, I can understand your outburst, to start with. I agree that all kinds of generalizations are false or, at least, seldom right.<BR/>On the other hand, I believe Kevin used «American» as an adjective, implying with it the «mainstream» way of thinking.<BR/>If you ask me, and if we face all issues and matters (not only gay issues in Poland or elsewhere), I suppose you'll agree with me when we,non Americans, say America (meaning the USA) doesn't give a damn for the rest of the world. If you read any important USA newspaper (or watch a news channel) you'll easily reach the conclusion that the rest of the world means very little, unless... American interests are at stake.<BR/>A country or a people is perceived by others through common places, or clichés, if you like. You just cannot avoid that. Nor prevent it. The USA is nowadays perceived through its actions worldwide. And those actions are decided by the American government, which Americans have elected. A second time. How can you find it so strange that Merica and Americans get identified with that government? There's no way you can do it otherwise, I think. That's just the power of majorities, right or wrong. I don't like - and don't approve of - flags being burned on the ground. But I can understand the feeling behind it.<BR/>All you can do is to fight those prejudices. But you won't go far in that fight if you start by exactly doing what that mainstream way of thinking does: rejecting and nothing else.<BR/>So, Gray, if I do understand you as one American person, I also understand others who in relation to certain issues see the USA as a whole. As myself.<BR/>And no comments are deleted on this blog unless bad language is used or the author decides to do so.<BR/>I wish you a fine Sunday! :-)RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162722614931316902006-11-05T10:30:00.000+00:002006-11-05T10:30:00.000+00:00Pardon me, Ric, but I am beginning to become highl...Pardon me, Ric, but I am beginning to become highly irritated at comments such as Kevin's!! So much so that I am finally going to "vent" about it! Forgive me if this is not the place to do it - feel free to delete this comment if you feel the need!<BR/><BR/>How (and, WHY) do people of the world continue to "body-slam" Americans as a whole? Kevin's statement (with which I take issue): "It looks like it [Poland] is using American rhetoric instead of more liberal and progressive ways."<BR/><BR/>How DARE he lump all Americans into one category??? For his and for your information, most polls taken in this country (the USA) show that the majority of Americans are IN FAVOR of gay rights (by a MINIMUM margine of 54%).<BR/><BR/>Now, if Kevin (or anyone else) wants to bash George W. Bush or other right wing, Christian conservative idiots: fine. But STOP slamming all Americans!! Stop thinking that it is "American rhetoric!"<BR/><BR/>Use the brain that God has given you, Kevin!! MOST of the the WORLD's population, does not believe in gay rights (NOT just Americans!)!<BR/><BR/>When polls show a majority of Americans favor gay rights, how do you dare say that such diatribe is "American" rhetoric??<BR/><BR/>I truly am offended that you see it that way! Even if our "elected" leaders are a bunch of asses, you are out of line by lumping all Americans into one boat!<BR/><BR/>Do I dare say you are prejudiced? Do I dare say that you have preconceived beliefs about Americans as a whole? Do I dare say that you are among the many American-bashers that do not know what they are talking about?<BR/><BR/>You are damned right that I dare!<BR/><BR/>If you want to put the blame on any group of people, Kevin, then blame all of the fanatically religious peoples of the world! Not JUST Americans! If you are some kind of simpleton who needs a "boogyman" to blame for the ills of the Polish government then let the "boogyman" be the fanatical religious people!<BR/><BR/>DO NOT just blame "American" rhetoric!<BR/><BR/>DAMN IT! Kevin's illiterate statement just pisses me off!Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08428046291631841793noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162704208696252782006-11-05T05:23:00.000+00:002006-11-05T05:23:00.000+00:00Hello Kevin! Is it not indeed?! I believe that gov...Hello Kevin! Is it not indeed?! I believe that government feels somehow protected at a very high, very important level: Rome...<BR/>Can you believe the words of those «ministers»?! Are we back in the heart of the Middle Ages?<BR/>I do hope too the EU power instances take action. This situation reminds me of Turkey: why is this country the only one to be considered not fully democratic? Is Poland fully democratic?<BR/>How can people be catholic and against basic human rights? This is too much for me to understand...<BR/>Thanks a lot!RIChttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13504864950306777236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31125887.post-1162701842209951082006-11-05T04:44:00.000+00:002006-11-05T04:44:00.000+00:00It is such a shame that a European Union member is...It is such a shame that a European Union member is acting so maliciously towards its own citizens. It looks like it is using American rhetoric instead of more liberal and progressive ways.<BR/><BR/>I hope that other EU states and citizens let the Polish government know that their behaviour is a denial of basic human rights and will not be tolerated.<BR/><BR/>Kevin in New Zealand.kevinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09675153688582065400noreply@blogger.com